Tailfeathers
Contact | Tour
where bird lovers gather
Bird InformationMessage BoardNetwork Home

 

Page 3 of 9 FirstFirst 1234567 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 121

Thread: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

  1. #31
    Tailfeather
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    6,397
    Thanks
    7
    Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    Quote Originally Posted by pine4parrots View Post
    there are a lot of nasty chemicals in phone books, also if you give your bird a whole book to chew (people do) there is glue holding the pages together NOT GOOD!!
    best to get unbleached paper, you can get news offcuts (newspaper without the ink) in 10kg packs, if you ask your local chippy if this is what they use, then ask if they can sell you a pack.
    it will last you ages, and its safe.
    In US & Canada phone books & newspaper are printed with soy or vegetable dye. And to get around the glue, the bound end of phone book can be cut off, and drilled to tie with safe rope/chain.

    Surrounded by people who love life, you love it too;
    surrounded by people who don't, you don't.
    ~Mignon McLaughlin

  2. #32
    Cream of Cockatiel Tailfeather sammit's Avatar
    Name
    Sam
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Brisbane, Australia
    Posts
    5,240
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 10 Times in 9 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    thats what i do... and so far no dead birds... ive been doing it for well over 5 years for mine and others birds and they are happy chomping away on pages


    "im now under the impression that sarcasm is the body's natural defence against stupid" - sam

    http://sammitshomecooking.blogspot.com/

  3. #33
    Brand New Egg
    Name
    yvonne
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    east yorkshire
    Posts
    67
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    Quote Originally Posted by merlinsmom View Post
    In US & Canada phone books & newspaper are printed with soy or vegetable dye. And to get around the glue, the bound end of phone book can be cut off, and drilled to tie with safe rope/chain.
    in USA they use toluene in their newspapers, just as they do hear.
    this is toxic to us, so not good for the birds.

  4. #34
    Brand New Egg
    Name
    yvonne
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    east yorkshire
    Posts
    67
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    just in case you think I am talking nonsence hears a link for you

    http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/view/92845
    I did look into this for the UK and the answer is YES its used over hear too,
    so newspaper IS NOT SAFE!!
    This also goes for magazines etc.......

  5. #35
    Tailfeather
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    6,397
    Thanks
    7
    Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    Well, thousands of bird lovers/breeders/experts use newspaper to line cages, and have for decades (omitting the coloured/glossy pages), it is considered safe. Almost everything we have in our homes off-gas chemicals...furniture, carpeting, etc, etc. We do our best to be safe, but save living in a bare box...... Of course we aren't trying to sell our wares by trashing other's....

    Surrounded by people who love life, you love it too;
    surrounded by people who don't, you don't.
    ~Mignon McLaughlin

  6. #36
    AKA 'Follyfoot Farm' Tailfeather
    Name
    Mel
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    NZ
    Posts
    6,011
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    Om nom nom nom NEWSPAPER!

    We have lined our cages with it for years... The lovies shredded it for their nest.
    omitting the coloured/glossy pages
    GOOGLE

    I know several vet nurses and a few vets-to-be... All of which use what? NEWSPAPER. Dead god that stuff must be positively TOXIC!


    Oh, and PLEASE tell me that you are NOT basing your statement on the ONE NEWSPAPER article? *where are the journalists when we need them?* I am not sure of the full evidence behind this, but if you are basing your entire theory on that one page. I would like to enlighten you a little about how journalism works (I was taught by a journalist on journalism in my english paper at uni)
    Journalists write what sells, they aim not to write for people, but for profit. They will do anything to get you going. If you believe everything you read in newspapers... you are very VERY naive.

    Anyway, you MAY have other evidence, but just failed to show it. Showing rather, a sad sorry excuse for evidence... a newspaper article.

    Now, back to the topic... If you feel that newspaper is unsafe... despite vast years of it being used by pet owners and professionals alike. Then I would much like to see your birds cage and all its toys (if I may do so?)

    I do hope all your toys are safe, nothing that can choke a bird, or have a bird tangled, nothing that splinters or nothing that cracks or rusts. Might I see some pics of your toys?


    You are, in my opinion, making a very bold statement
    "
    sorry to burst the bubble, but the author of this book has done no research on what is safe for our birds, and lots of items she uses are dangerous.
    "
    And then failing to deliver any evidence to the contrary. Why should I buy your side of the story? How do I know that you have any clue on the matter what so ever?


    Yup, it is 2am, I have just got home from work and your attitude got to me a bit.

    Before you ask, yes I am a b!tch...
    But I am an honest b!tch.

  7. #37
    Brand New Egg
    Name
    yvonne
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    east yorkshire
    Posts
    67
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    Quote Originally Posted by Melza View Post
    Om nom nom nom NEWSPAPER!

    We have lined our cages with it for years... The lovies shredded it for their nest.


    GOOGLE

    I know several vet nurses and a few vets-to-be... All of which use what? NEWSPAPER. Dead god that stuff must be positively TOXIC!


    Oh, and PLEASE tell me that you are NOT basing your statement on the ONE NEWSPAPER article? *where are the journalists when we need them?* I am not sure of the full evidence behind this, but if you are basing your entire theory on that one page. I would like to enlighten you a little about how journalism works (I was taught by a journalist on journalism in my english paper at uni)
    Journalists write what sells, they aim not to write for people, but for profit. They will do anything to get you going. If you believe everything you read in newspapers... you are very VERY naive.

    Anyway, you MAY have other evidence, but just failed to show it. Showing rather, a sad sorry excuse for evidence... a newspaper article.

    Now, back to the topic... If you feel that newspaper is unsafe... despite vast years of it being used by pet owners and professionals alike. Then I would much like to see your birds cage and all its toys (if I may do so?)

    I do hope all your toys are safe, nothing that can choke a bird, or have a bird tangled, nothing that splinters or nothing that cracks or rusts. Might I see some pics of your toys?


    You are, in my opinion, making a very bold statement
    ""
    And then failing to deliver any evidence to the contrary. Why should I buy your side of the story? How do I know that you have any clue on the matter what so ever?


    Yup, it is 2am, I have just got home from work and your attitude got to me a bit.
    actually my birds are safe, they have loads of toys, nothing to tangle up in, the way I cut my pine, IT DOES NOT SPLINTER!! they have NO TOXIC toys, they have NO chains, NO ROPE!! all metal is stainless steel, even their flights are meashed with stainless steel.
    the bottom of cages are lined with news offcuts, this is newspaper WITHOUT the ink.
    I use veg tanned leather for all their toys, not USA leather as this is toxic, you all think its safe, but dont realise that in the USA they tann the leather with OAK tanning, this is toxic for birds.
    yes I did look into the toluene, and it IS toxic, and in most newspapers, a few modern printers can remove the toluene, but its only a few as yet.

    someone once told a rescuer I know, their bird had newspaper, and books etc... and they smoked, and was very proud their bird lived to 20,
    she was told, "that's good", but the bird should have lived to 45.

    toxins will kill slowly, so if you only want your bird to live half its life, then fine.
    but some people want to keep their birds.
    and as to selling my wares, I dont ship to the USA etc..... so I am hardly trying to sell you things.
    I was actually trying to help,
    please do what I do, if someone tells me something is toxic, then if the doupt has been implanted in my mind.
    for my birds sake I look it up,

  8. #38
    Breeding
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    2,400
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    There are very few presses currently using toluene, mostly small, old distributors.

    As of the last 20 years, the majority have switched over to using soy or canola based inks. If you can get them fresh of the press, the papers are actually very close to sterile (of course this is gone after distribution).

    It's not something to go crazy over. Sometimes, in the top right corner of the paper, there will be a symbol of some sort, identifying the ink and process.

    If you're unsure, phone your paper company and ask them what kind of ink they use. I'm willing to be that they say it is 'organic', or they will say some compound of soy or canola.

  9. #39
    Egg's Cracking... Clairey331's Avatar
    Name
    birdy
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    england
    Posts
    226
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    Can i just interfere here and tell you that Yvonne has researched the safety, covering all aspects of this subject in great detailed length, for a number of years. Why dont you try it. Then you might begin to understand the dangers.

    It has nothing to do with reading one article in a newspaper, christ. I am aware she searches high and low for answers, questioning manufactures, if she still cant find an answer and she is in doubt she would not use a product fullstop. Which i think would be the best option.

    Yvonne was nicely letting people know of the dangers discussed on this thread.

    I believe your response has been unhelpful and somewhat immature. Would you prefer someone to have come on and given you ill advise instead?

    As to the "selling her wares" thats just rubbish. Look for any advertising ANYWHERE on the net by Yvonne, you wont find any. She sells amazing products and quite frankly i wouldnt buy from anyone else. I know the toys she provides are SAFE and non TOXIC. The business she gets is purely by word of mouth, by customers who are very happy with Yvonne products, advise and help. She has on a number of occasions told me how to make my own toys myself, however, i much prefer Yvonne to make my birds toys for me. Her ideas are amazing, and i know they are safe for my birds.

    Lets keep this varied opinions lark civil shall we.

  10. #40
    AKA 'Follyfoot Farm' Tailfeather
    Name
    Mel
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    NZ
    Posts
    6,011
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    I know, their bird had newspaper, and books etc... and they smoked
    Note the 'smoked' in this sentence

    toxins will kill slowly, so if you only want your bird to live half its life, then fine.
    but some people want to keep their birds.
    So you are telling me that by using newspaper, I am killing my birds? Thanks... and just so you know... I am NOT in the USA

    please do what I do, if someone tells me something is toxic, then if the doupt has been implanted in my mind.
    for my birds sake I look it up,
    And you think that we dont do that either? That is half the reason we are here. I google, and research... hell I even study animals at a university level! If that is not researching, then please tell me what is.

    Can i just interfere here and tell you that Yvonne has researched the safety, covering all aspects of this subject in great detailed length, for a number of years. Why dont you try it. Then you might begin to understand the dangers.
    She may well have done, but so far I am seeing no evidence. I have been taught to be sceptical, to question everything and believe nothing. Anyone can pop up online and claim to know it all. I will not believe them, not even a word until I get proof. I am sorry, but that is just how I am. And if I need proof, then I am sure others do as well.

    and the "why dont you try it" line you added, that is frustrating. Because you are assuming that I dont research at all. That I have not picked up a book on birds, nor spent hours studying them. Completely uncalled for.

    I believe your response has been unhelpful and somewhat immature. Would you prefer someone to have come on and given you ill advise instead?
    Believe what you like, I would prefer someone who comes on and says "No, this is wrong" to back it up with evidence. Anyone can say 'this is wrong', that does not make it fact. Proof is in the pudding so they say. My response was to stop any new members believing everything they read. If you feel it is immature, then you are welcome to think that.

    I know the toys she provides are SAFE
    Not entirely what I have heard...


    Lets keep this varied opinions lark civil shall we
    Whatever you say, but I will still fight for facts and evidence. Dont like it? Lump it. People NEED to realise that words mean nothing when they are not back up.

    Before you ask, yes I am a b!tch...
    But I am an honest b!tch.

  11. #41
    Tailfeather
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    6,397
    Thanks
    7
    Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    CURRENT information about news paper inks. (USA)
    Ink oil falls into a class of highly refined petroleum oils that will not readily evaporate. These oils are approved for direct food contact and are used in a variety of common food and pharmaceutical products.
    In a nutshell, once dry the (very little) chemical/petroleum content(used to quicken the drying time of the soy/vegetable dyes) is safe....to touch, eat off, etc. It emits no fumes, does not off gas once dry. Of course it should not be ingested. Anyway, when parrots shred they are not ingesting. If they do then that item should be removed. Obviously. That includes pine.


    Again, we ARE bird lovers. We go to great lengths to ensure their safety & well being. We do research, we do supervise their play/toys. Will it be PERFECT? No...even the wild is not 100% safe. No toy is 100% safe.
    To imply the WE love our birds less than YOU is insulting. Period.
    Last edited by ~Lori~; 12-05-2009 at 05:28 PM.

    Surrounded by people who love life, you love it too;
    surrounded by people who don't, you don't.
    ~Mignon McLaughlin

  12. #42
    Brand New Egg
    Name
    yvonne
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    east yorkshire
    Posts
    67
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    Melza, if you have something to say about my toys and there safety, then please say it.
    I do everything possible to make sure I make safe toys, please share what you have heard.


    for years people have been using newspapers for pets, experts told us it was safe, even when it had lead in it, then it is discovered it is not safe.

    so now we have safer inks, the so called experts tell us again it is now safe, so we believe them again.
    there are added chemicals in the newspapers, so they are not chemicals free, Since 2004, 95% of American newspaper ink is now soy based, as opposed to petroleum based. It is not considered to be 100% biodegradable, because it is still mixed with additives, resins, pigments, and waxes.

    I cant understand why people give their birds newspaper, have you considered the germs on an old newspaper, not very nice for your bird to chew,
    and old phone books, they have a year of use, loads of fingers touching it for a full year, then when it's of no use, people give it to the parrot. a dirty old phone book for a toy!! YUK

    its so easy to buy news offcuts, I cant see why anyone would chance newspaper.
    YOU SAY YOU RESEARCH, then why does no one seem to realise that veg tanned leather is not as safe as we are all told.
    its everywhere!! all the experts tell us its safe, we all use it, no one questions it.
    yet it all depends on what its tanned with, if its tanned with oak tanning, or other tanning's toxic to birds, then its not safe, IS IT.
    I agree not to believe what people say, so if in doubt, check it out.
    DEFRA is a good place to start.

  13. #43
    Cream of Cockatiel Tailfeather sammit's Avatar
    Name
    Sam
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Brisbane, Australia
    Posts
    5,240
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 10 Times in 9 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    ok you say "dirty" phone books.. really tell me the difference between the phone book and a piece of timber from the hardware or lumber yards that hes been near toxins and pollutants from the surrounding woods? or the fumes from the cars and forklifts that are used to transport it. not to mention the HUNDREDS of people who have touched that piece of wood before it gets to me. so tell me whats the difference?

    i have phone books at home still wrapped in the plastic because i collect the ones people dont want to use that are delivered outside their homes. they arent "dirty" or touched by hundreds of people. maybe a few people yes, but its not like we go to the nearest phone booth and take the one from there!!! sheesh give us some credit.

    you keep going on and on about being bird safe and then make an accusation like that. im thinking you are trying to make us look like we have no idea. because right now its coming across as you with a god complex and we're the kids in the gutter picking our noses. if you have had a chance to look ANYWHERE on this site you will see that we are given and are giving the best researched advice we can. this site has almost 50 if i dare say not more higher educated people strictly on animal or science subjects alone!!!


    "im now under the impression that sarcasm is the body's natural defence against stupid" - sam

    http://sammitshomecooking.blogspot.com/

  14. #44
    What a marshmallow Hatching ashie's Avatar
    Name
    Ashleigh
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Sydney Australia
    Posts
    461
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    Quote Originally Posted by sammit View Post
    you keep going on and on about being bird safe and then make an accusation like that. im thinking you are trying to make us look like we have no idea. because right now its coming across as you with a god complex and we're the kids in the gutter picking our noses. if you have had a chance to look ANYWHERE on this site you will see that we are given and are giving the best researched advice we can. this site has almost 50 if i dare say not more higher educated people strictly on animal or science subjects alone!!!
    I agree Like seriously is Yvonne trying to tell me that everything in my courses I've sat through the past year is a lie....Like I've also noticed a of people here are educated and know their stuff... But seriously don't believe anything on the internet that you can "google" cause it could be written by some nine year old for all you know! *kills Wikipedia* ..
    This is why i Love this form cause we get to well kinder talk to real people..

    And maybe Yvonne is right or maybe not but being all aggressive and rude really won't get people listening nor taking you seriously...
    But like Mel said Yvonne you haven't really provided any real proof or evidence other then "Cause I'm saying it, that makes it true"
    Hunting is not a sport. In a sport, both sides should know they're in the game. ~Paul Rodriguez

  15. #45
    First Baby Hatched!
    Name
    Lee
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    England
    Posts
    3,223
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 10 Times in 8 Posts

    Re: Enrichment e-book. A must see!

    I do everything possible to make sure I make safe toys, please share what you have heard.
    I'm more than sure that you do all the research you can,Yvonne. Helen (pixibubbles) can't sing your praises high enough, and has such good reports on your products that I have every faith that you do your best to make sure they are safe. Nothing is ever going to be 100% safe for birds, people..anything. It's just not achievable.

    All of the people here, especially those who have posted in this thread so far, do their best. It's unfair to assume that with little to no evidence of what you're talking about that people should immediatley agree with your opinion, and to keep telling people 'do your research' etc. without prior knowledge of how much these members actually do research things, is again a little unfair and edging on ignorant.
    Trashing the author of the book you mention, also, is wildy speculative. You have no evidence to prove that the published book is dangerous, only your opinion.
    Last edited by leebee; 12-07-2009 at 06:14 AM.

Remove Ads

Similar Threads

  1. Diet Enrichment...
    By Naava in forum Budgie Care, Feeding, Dangers, Health
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 09-03-2011, 02:01 PM
  2. Awesome parrot enrichment e-book
    By McDenny in forum General Discussion
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 03-27-2008, 02:13 PM
  3. GCC Enrichment
    By Nutterly_Uts in forum Conures
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 06-25-2007, 07:19 AM
  4. Parrot Enrichment and Activity Book<pdf >
    By Mysticalwings in forum Homemade Bird Toys/Recipes
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 01-27-2007, 10:55 AM
  5. Enrichment
    By Mysticalwings in forum Homemade Bird Toys/Recipes
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 03-01-2006, 05:04 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Message BoardNetwork Home