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Thread: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby Bird

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    Jaspa Egg's Cracking... Jaspa's Avatar
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    Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby Bird

    Hi,

    I am in need of some urgent advice.

    I got a baby hand reared cockatiel on Tuesday from a bird shop - she is mostly grey and I thought she looked okay.

    However, I quarantined my 6 year old tiel Jaspa at my mother's and have been changing clothes, tying hair back and using antiseptic soap between visits as I still do everything for Jaspa at mum's (who lives next door). I have been keeping my new baby bird in the spare room with the door shut (and feel sorry for her). The first day I had a minor lapse and there was some indirect contact between the birds (ie a bird stain on the top of my shoulder and kissing each bird separately (see below), but I think that will be okay).

    I took her to the vet on Saturday for a general check (dropping samples, blood tests, psistocisis test etc and everything was fine but the avian vet was concerned at her feather condition and said her feathers were growing abnormally and were dirty. He has done a beak and feather disease test and this gets sent away to a university vet school tomorrow and results take two weeks. Meanwhile Jaspa is staying at my mum's.

    I called up the place I got the vet and told them about my vet's concern (who incidentally are all caged together as babies, and taken to the bird shop for crop feeding a few times a week when she works there) and not surprisingly she was defensive and adament neither the parents nor the babies have this disease.

    I feel really sorry for the bird as she is very lonely but I am paranoid in case the test being negative and having then to wait another few weeks for incubation and have another test, meanwhile Jaspa is having to stay (hopefully) at mum's. She tolerates mum but I am her main carer. But if I am in limbo there is still the chance Jaspa might pick something up.

    I don't know what to do. My main concern is Jaspa and I would be heartbroken if she was to get this disease if this bird is carrying it (though she is an adult and in good health, and on Harrisons pellets).

    Sorry this is long winded; what do people think? My mum thinks I should take the baby back to the shop and ask them to rehome her (but I won't ask for my money back) on Wednesday (I am taking a day off work to break up the week for the baby bird, though I have my mum and friend pop in a few times a day to check on her).

    Even if the test comes back negative, because the vet is concerned, I am paranoid for Jaspa's sake and am in a real panic and feel very upset about it all. I could be waiting in limbo for weeks living in a state of stress. My vet told me to wait for the test results but I'm not so sure, yet I want to do the best I can for this baby without affecting Jaspa. I have already spent $450 on vet bills and it could be more if I need more tests becasue of the vet's concerns.

    I'll post pics later tonight of her feathers.

    Thanks so much for any advice,
    Karen

    Tiels Gabi (RIP Aug 2011 - 3 yrs) and Jaspa (RIP Sept 2014 - 12 yrs); Tiel Olli (3 yrs)
    Budgies Sam and Zakie - RIP

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    Tailfeather di_dee1's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    What a horrible situation for you to be in. I too would be so worried about my existing bird. I would (even though be sad for this little one) take it back to them as them selling it in this condition, you buying it and taking on all the care needed, takes the resposnibility of it and the health of other birds there away from them. I would also be giving them a copy of any test results or a letter from the vet along with it.
    My first thoughts would be though for the health of my existing bird. So very very glad you were so responsible and he is next door.

    I just re read your post and there are no findings as yet. Such a hard decision to make.

  3. #3
    Jaspa Egg's Cracking... Jaspa's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    I've just been out walking with my friend that pops in to my place to check on the little one. She has offered to have Gaby (the baby) from Wednesday during the week and I'll get her in the weekend and give her back again until the test results come through. The offer was so I could have Jaspa here but I don't really want Jaspa here until I get the results.

    Also, I have the new baby on Harrisons pellets already and been putting vitamin drops in her water. She eats a lot (more when someone is around) but also notice she is drinking excessively (more than Jaspa).

    She is molting and the breeder/pet store worker actually said some of the lorries may have pecked at her in the crate she houses them all together in ). The feathers problem may just be her and not a disease so I may be worrying unnecessarily about her having this disease but I am in a real dilemma just in case.

    I am hoping for some advice on here to decide whether to hold off two weeks and let my friend have her and I'll visit her (and leave Jaspa where she is too), or take her back to the shop. I havnt developed a bond with her yet as I am kind of keeping myself aloof in case it all turns bad. If I didnt have Jaspa I'd care for her, have her out in the living room, and give her lots of love even with the disease and try and give her a happy time for as long as I could but Jaspa has to be my main concern. I have too strong a bond (and her to me) with Jaspa that it would be really devastating to lose her over this.

    I am also worried that if she has this disease I believe it can be transmitted via feather dust (and droppings) and I may have carried the feather dust on my tshirt to Jaspa the first day before I started changing clothes - however I read on the internet some older birds may be able to fight it off or not develop the symptons (though still carry it) because they have a better immune system and Jaspa is on the Harrisons too. Fingers crossed.

    I'd really welcome any thoughts/comments/advice as to what people think I should do.

    Thanks again!

    Tiels Gabi (RIP Aug 2011 - 3 yrs) and Jaspa (RIP Sept 2014 - 12 yrs); Tiel Olli (3 yrs)
    Budgies Sam and Zakie - RIP

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    I'm to young to be Breeding VJS+1Cockatiel's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    aw, I'm so sorry to hear that Karen. I hope(for yours and jaspers sake) that the baby is healthy and its nothing. What an awful situation for you to be in. I'm so sorry. You and the bay will DEF be in my thoughts and prayers.
    Keep us updated!

    ÷No bird soars too high if he soars with his own wings.-William Blake(1757-1827)
    ÷It is not only fine feathers that make up fine birds-Aesop(620-560
    ÷Even small birds are a BIG responsibility.

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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    is it an avian certified vet or just a small animal clinic..?
    you are already considering taking the bird back because of speculation from the vet without waiting for the test results..!
    they have your $450 and they have you stressing and doubting the other bird, they will probably get more money out of you..! ( how ? )
    the bird may return a negative result and all this stress was for nothing.. ( stress on you and the bird )
    if the results come back positive.. quarantine the bird for a further 60 days and have it tested again. it is common for a young bird to test positive and then negative 60 days later.
    i wish you and your birds all the best

    now to this
    My main concern is Jaspa and I would be heartbroken if she was to get this disease if this bird is carrying it (though she is an adult and in good health, and on Harrisons pellets).
    [B]Also, I have the new baby on Harrisons pellets[/B] already and been putting vitamin drops in her water
    i am unsure as to why you would mention twice that you feed your birds harrisons pellets.. it won't help them against PBFD.

    regards
    matty

  6. #6
    Jaspa Egg's Cracking... Jaspa's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    Thanks - avian certified I believe.
    I guess I shouldn't jump to conclusions just yet and I don't really want to return her as she is a little cutie although months of quarantine will be awful here when I live in a small two bedroom unit with the bedrooms side by side and the rest open plan. Not to mention the loneliness of both birds meantime. And having months of absolute hygiene.
    In relation to Harrisons - I realise it wont help prevent PBFD but I do think it is healthy along with fruit and vegs etc - I didnt realise I had noted it twice.

    I've been trying to download pics onto photobucket but it's not cooperating tonight so will try tomorrow night.

    Tiels Gabi (RIP Aug 2011 - 3 yrs) and Jaspa (RIP Sept 2014 - 12 yrs); Tiel Olli (3 yrs)
    Budgies Sam and Zakie - RIP

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    Resident Vampire Hormonal ellenant's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    Well.... I dont really believe in these vitamin drops...

    All you can do now is wait for the test, I am afraid.
    If the bird is moulting, I wont be too afraid about PBFD...
    but you never know.
    Yes, the virus can be transmitted through dust and poops,
    and it is better to change clothes between birds.

    I hope all turns out to be well!
    I think of you!
    "There must have been a moment, at the beginning, where we could have said- NO. But somehow we missed it." (Samuel Beckett)


    Dear Alex, in memory Axolotls rock!
    Missing you, Waiata...

    Wild NZ Birds! http://www.tailfeathersnetwork.com/c...ad.php?t=57986

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    Jaspa Egg's Cracking... Jaspa's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    Thanks Ellen. How common is it?
    The sample is coming down your way tomorrow for the test.

    Tiels Gabi (RIP Aug 2011 - 3 yrs) and Jaspa (RIP Sept 2014 - 12 yrs); Tiel Olli (3 yrs)
    Budgies Sam and Zakie - RIP

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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    i can tell you what my ACV told me when i met a bird with PBFD in his waiting room, and of course asked if i should be worried for sparks (There's a post somewhere one either this or the lovie board). slight paraphrasing but:

    "Yes it's very contagious, to baby birds or those in poor health. and as bad as sparks health has been with URI's, even she isnt in the risk catagroy. DO you really think i would put my patients at risk? or my parrots at home? Exactly."

    check here
    http://www.avianweb.com/PBFD.html

    i know that R&R here has first hand experience of the disease and lost part of her flock to it, but they were under stressful conditions prior to it, and i think interacted quite closely... ie preening one another etc

    i also know at least one of her infected lovebirds made a full recovery and even had eggs this year! and lovebirds are teeny compared to teils x


    Thanks Lee for the adorable sig!

  10. #10
    Resident Vampire Hormonal ellenant's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    Hi Karen,
    it should not be too common in NZ, not as common
    as eg. in Australia. Thanks to MAF.
    So keep your hopes up.
    But, depending on the pet shop--
    the first cockatiel I had had a virus similar to Budge fledgling disease virus
    (together with psittacosis and aspergillosis) and this
    is a EXOTIC disease in NZ and should NOT be here at all...
    But I dont want to frighten you!
    Keep fingers crossed!
    "There must have been a moment, at the beginning, where we could have said- NO. But somehow we missed it." (Samuel Beckett)


    Dear Alex, in memory Axolotls rock!
    Missing you, Waiata...

    Wild NZ Birds! http://www.tailfeathersnetwork.com/c...ad.php?t=57986

  11. #11
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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    I am sorry you are going through this, but don't worry... think positive.

    I once thought my lovebird Eddie had PFBD and had him tested because the feathers around his eyes were not coming in normally. Come to find out it was steam from the shower that was irritating them. Chemicals they treat tap water with. I hope there is some other reason why her feathers are looking funny.

    I read you are giving vitamin drops and harrison's pellets... I wouldn't do that for fear of vitaminosis. If a human or animal takes in too many man-made vitamins, the body can't shed them off like they can if they are derived from natural foods. They can actually be toxic!

    There is still much heated debate as to if a diet made up of 100% pellets is already too rich in vitamins. Vitamins in water also speed up the bacteria reproduction in there. I would ditch those all together. I like to feed fresh veggies (frozen in a bag is an easy, cheap alternative too) so that they get some vitamins from natural foods as well as seed and pellets.

    Good luck, keep us posted. I will keep my fingers crossed for you.

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    Jaspa Egg's Cracking... Jaspa's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    Thanks for the comments - I really appreciate it.
    I have been feeling very low these past few days.
    The vitamins are from a petstore rather than human ones. The bottle's at mum's house at the moment so cant check the label but its for birds (though I have hardly used it really)). That's interesting about the vitamins in Harrisons - perhaps that's why Jaspa gets bacterial infections from time to time though I put a drop of organic cider vinegar in her water twice daily. Jaspa gets vegies (not so keen on fruit), and I also give her seeds from time to time, and nuts etc. I had intended to grow dandelion in a pot but haven't got around to it yet.
    I am trying to get Gaby, the new bird, to eat vegies daily and she hoes into brocolli so must have been given that from the breeder.

    Just to give an update.

    I spoke to my vet this morning and asked him in his experience if he thinks it could be PBFD and he said probably not but he doesn't want to rule it out. From that conversation I decided to keep Gaby and wait for the results.

    However, my mother rung me at 4pm today in a panic saying she felt Gaby was lonely in the bedroom, not eating and looked sad and hadnt moved much. I got home as fast as I could and she had been in a few places in her cage and eaten just a little. When my friend visited she ate then too. It seems Gaby waits for my mum or friend to pop their head in the door to eat. I then spent three hours playing with her out of her cage with toys tonight and even got her rolling the ping pong ball. The vet nurse said if she was depressed she wouldn't likely even play with the toys with me, but she did and she ate and drunk water and preened herself. I feel I actually started forming a bond with her tonight now.
    I was feeling really sad for her loneliness (temporary until the quarantine is over and she'll have company with Jaspa) so have arranged for a friend's 14 year old to come over for a few hours tomorrow and then Gaby will go to my friends on both Thursday and Friday and all of next week during the day which will take me to the test results date (my friend is on holidays).
    I have also found a pet carer/walker who is willing to have her on a daily basis to provide some interaction and check she's eating and my aunt who lives two hours away has offered to have her if need be so I now feel like I have some light at the end of the tunnell - well until the test results and hopefully they'll come back negative.

    Tiels Gabi (RIP Aug 2011 - 3 yrs) and Jaspa (RIP Sept 2014 - 12 yrs); Tiel Olli (3 yrs)
    Budgies Sam and Zakie - RIP

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    Jaspa Egg's Cracking... Jaspa's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    PS none of these people who are offering to have Gaby have pet birds.

    Tiels Gabi (RIP Aug 2011 - 3 yrs) and Jaspa (RIP Sept 2014 - 12 yrs); Tiel Olli (3 yrs)
    Budgies Sam and Zakie - RIP

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    Jaspa Egg's Cracking... Jaspa's Avatar
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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    Just to let you know Gaby's results for beak and feather disease were negative. I am so relieved and now glad I didnt act rash - I kept up the quarantine with Jaspa at my mother's and Gaby in my second bedroom.

    I'm talking to the vet Wednesday to see when I can introduce the birds now that all the tests are done. Gaby is so different from Jaspa and loves playing with toys, jumps from perch to perch and from her cage outside and is really confident - she also likes giving kisses on your face. Jaspa prefers to snuggle but also is affectionate! I'll post some pictures soon when I can psyche myself up to loading with dial-up internet!

    Thanks for your input again.

    Tiels Gabi (RIP Aug 2011 - 3 yrs) and Jaspa (RIP Sept 2014 - 12 yrs); Tiel Olli (3 yrs)
    Budgies Sam and Zakie - RIP

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    Re: Urgent Help: Vet Concerned about Possible Beak and Feather Disease of New Baby B

    That's great news!!! You must be soooo relieved.

    We're looking forward to pix of the introduction!

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